Talk:Manual/Automatic downloading
More variables? In these threads 1, 2 they have been mentioned some more variables that seem related to downloading and fast downloading: cl_wwwDownload, sv_wwwDownload, sv_wwwDlDisconnected, cl_downloadSpeed. I'm not even sure they really exist, and that they work, so I didn't write about them in the article. If someone has got some certain info about them, let's talk about it! --The Gig 21:18, February 28, 2011 (UTC) : None of the *_wwwDownload cvars exist in ioquake3. The download speed in id Tech 3 is limited by the client's rate setting or sv_maxRate, whichever is lower. The is no cl_downloadSpeed cvar in my quake3-1.32b source. : If I had to guess I'd say the www cvars are from etpub or some other mod. : r9k 16:25, February 7, 2012 (UTC) tldr The whole entry is way too long to be read fully. As a player I'm only interested in "Why do I need this? What does it do on my PC? How to I en/disable it?". As an admin I might be interested in "How does it work? What are its dis/advantages? How to set it up?". The "slow" downloads are no longer slow in ioquake3. Take a look at its readme regarding sv_dlRate ("capped at about 1 Mbyte/s per client, so curl downloading may still be faster"). Unfortunately the OA executables are horribly outdated (that's what happens when maintaining yet another unneccessary fork..). Besides calling the curl way of downloading "http download" is wrong, as it works with ftp as well. The default setting of cl_allowDownload 0 could be linked to NOTTODO. pk3 files do not neccessarily need to be compressed, you can use the "store" option of Zip as well. The "download location" section should use the "basepath" name for the installation folder. The "how to setup" section(s) contain duplicated content. The whole "you may need to create a custom configuration file" about sv_allowDownload is obsolete, just use "setA" to write to its value to q3config_server.cfg automatically. People most likely don't care where automatic downloading came from. If you're so inclined you should add that this feature is clientside only (you can use "sets sv_dlURL xy" on id q3ded as well). Saying that ioq3 only added "some fixes and features" is a plain insult and sounds very much like leilol wrote that line. OA does not only use these fixes&featuers, it uses ioquake3 as a whole. The "fast downloading" section says to "re-create the "baseoa" directory". You should be more explicit and state that you only need to provide files that you've added to baseoa (there's no point in providing the default paks from the core game installation) or in general files that you've added on top of the default installation (which should be stored in homepath). The whole section about FTP being insecure is pointless. You are giving away your username:password string in sv_dlURL anyways, no need to sniff traffic clientside, just query the server.. Meh, long and unstructured post. In short; I'd re-write the entire article. r9k 15:12, February 4, 2012 (UTC) : The cURL site claims that you could use "protocol://usr:pwd@srv:port/path", but I haven't tested this. : r9k 15:30, February 4, 2012 (UTC) ::Hi! It was not Fromhell to write this page, it was me. I can assure the sentence about ioquake was absolutely NOT intended to offend it at all (ps: I have absolutely no idea about why relationships between Leileilol/Fromhell and ioquake3 devs are not good); of course ioq3 is named here as a tribute to the fact that the fast downloading has been invented by ioquake3 and not by OA... it's simply for giving the right attribution to the feature! About the various aspects you mentioned, we can talk about them (there are some things you mentioned that sound interesting!)... I hope you can wait for me for about two days, because I'm really busy with real life. In the meanwhile, if you wish, you may write a "Manual/Configuration files" page, where you may say how q3config_server.cfg works (and how other configuration files work) . I haven't figured yet the exact behavior of q3config_server... Bye! --The Gig 01:38, February 5, 2012 (UTC) :::Hi! As a very first step, I changed this: "some"-->"many" (ioq3 fixes) and made even more clear that ioquake3 is the engine of OpenArena (anyway, that OpenArena uses ioquake3 and not simply its autodownload feature was clear enough also before: with the sentence being inside the brackets instead of outside, it was clear that it was talking about the whole ioquake3 and not simply about the autodownload feature). I'm thinking about moving something to a "notes" section (using "ref" and "references" tags), or maybe dividing the section with more sub-sections... (or maybe even creating an expandable box like Wikipedia:Template:Hidden may be good, but I don't know if I'm capable of creating it).... but anyway there is already a section that says how to set up in very short (and the later sections are thought for those who want to know everything that may be useful to deal with autodownloads... so I don't know if shortening is a good or a bad idea). I have to try some things you mentioned, when I just have a bit of time. In the meanwhile, can you tell me something about the questions I placed in the "More variables?" section above in this page? Thank you! See you later, real life is calling me now... :) ! --The Gig 09:02, February 6, 2012 (UTC) :::: I don't know whether the repetition in short and long form is a good idea. There's not much to setup for the clients, but server admins should know about all the detail. As a first step we'd need a separate article about ".pk3", since that's what autodownloads are all about. Then also link to mod, which explains some technical detail. This way the introduction of this article can be kept rather short. :::: As said, I would rewrite the entire article from scratch. I don't know whether this is wanted? :::: P.S.: I can't really say much about q3config_server.cfg, it's just the server variant of q3config.cfg, both of which are automatically generated by the engine. There are also default.cfg and autoexec.cfg. Config files can basically contain any of the commands, which are currently in Console commands and Command Console. :::: r9k 16:36, February 7, 2012 (UTC) :::::I don't think a complete rewrite is needed. Maybe in part it's because I sweated to write all this page and seeing all that work wiped out would make me a little sad... but for sure, in part it's because the required infos for admins are already in the page, and removing them just to add them again using different words sounds a bit like a waste of time (there are many other pages that need to be created or expanded; e.g. do you want to create the .pk3 article?). Of course, if you think there is something important to say that have not beed said yet, you can add it. And, IMHO (and I repeat IMHO), the "short" instructions and the "long" instructions, in this particular case, should work enough. To shorten the intro, I just splitted it by using a section. What do you think about using notes, or more sub-sections, as I proposed above? --The Gig 17:28, February 7, 2012 (UTC) :::::: Your information and work would not be lost, I would just rewrite the article and try to conserve all its content. As I've said I think the article is too long currently and as such I don't think there's a point in editing it partially. I'm willing to commit that "waste of time" due to this reason :) :::::: I don't think there's much to add currently. There might be more technical details, but these should be in some default hidden template or their own article. :::::: I will write the .pk3 article. Should I use ".pk3" as its name? I've seen it has been linked to a few times likes this already. Can I talk to you via IM? I find this wiki:talk somewhat slow and tiresome, though it indeed is more transparent to others. :::::: r9k 18:45, February 7, 2012 (UTC) :::::::Of course it may be nice to talk using IM, but I'm not used to use them anymore (I still have ICQ installed from the days I was in a Q3 clan, or even before... but I almost never open it nowadays)... and I cannot assure to be online on a certain hour or a certain date... real life is sucking my time! If you don't find the wiki comfortable to talk, an alternative is using the forum (there is this apposite thread about improvements in the wiki... e.g. we may use it to ask others which will be the best name for the article about pk3 files -let's remember that we can use redirects anyway-.), but of couse it's not the same as IM. --The Gig 21:51, February 7, 2012 (UTC) An update about sv_dlrate: in the forum Sago said he tried to import that into openarena engine, but he did not succeed. I hope in the future he may try again and have more luck... --The Gig 23:25, February 22, 2012 (UTC) : That's bad news. It shouldn't be that difficult, but it seems like the OA fork is hopelessly chaotic. Maybe they should start from a fresh ioq copy and re-apply their changes. : Anyways, server admins should still be able to just build and run ioq3ded with some cvar settings for OA to get all the nifty new features. : // r9k 14:34, February 24, 2012 (UTC) libcurl troubleshooting libcurl troubleshooting You could just have reset the cl_cURLlib variable (instead of editing q3config.cfg {which is a bad idea in itself} and looking up its default value); reset Iirc you will have to restart OA for the changes to take effect. I'd drop the "maybe this does not affect Windows systems" note. I do think Windows is affected as well, besides it won't hurt to try the fix anyways. All the symlinking is bad and would only fix an otherwise broken system. Besides it's an inferiour solution compared to just changing the cl_cURLlib cvar. Searching for the libcurl filename could be done like this; sudo ldconfig -v | grep libcurl // r9k 15:05, February 9, 2012 (UTC) :Hi! I was searching a thread about automatic downloads -about download speed-, and I accidentally found this one about the cURLlib problem (plus, another one where the problem was caused by copying a linux OA config to OSX). So I transported that infos to the wiki. * I didn't know "reset" command; interesting: you can add it (replacing the sentence about manually editing config file), sure. * I have done some tests with Windows today (cl_curllib is set to libcrurl-3.dll, there).... changing it did not change anything (not even after closing and restarting the game): I was still able to download at high speed even if I set that variable to "goofy.dll", and I haven't seen that warning message in the console... so I supposed Windows does not care about it (maybe recent execuables do not need the external library anymore on any OS?), I don't know. Do you have more infos? * About the symlinking, it's the solution they proposed in that thread... so I reported it, but with smaller fonts because I thought the solution of changing the variable in the game should be better (but it was not named in that thread, I guessed it!). :If you wanna do changes to that section, feel free to do them. If you want to talk more, I'm here... :) --The Gig 21:54, February 9, 2012 (UTC) :: I have checked ioquake3 and it seems like the mingw32 Windows builds include libcurl statically by default. The library is thus part of openarena.exe and you should even be able to remove libcurl-3.dll in that case (which might be left over from another installation?), the cl_cURLlib cvar is then unused. This all depends on how the binaries are built, dynamically linking against libcurl is the better option (and the default for all other platforms). :: // r9k 14:01, February 10, 2012 (UTC) :::Thank you for the precious infos. I guessed something similar. Do you want to propose Sago to do the binaries building in a different way? It would be better if you could use the forum and ask it yourself (you would explain that much better than how I could). For the moment, if you wanna do some adjustments to the section... --The Gig 00:30, February 11, 2012 (UTC) :::: I don't know why the ioquake3 team chose those defaults, but they propably had a good reason. Anyways, you can still get dynamical linking by setting USE_CURL_DLOPEN=1 in Makefile.local. :::: // r9k 16:22, February 11, 2012 (UTC) :::::How do you suggst to adjust the sentence about it here on the wiki? From "maybe this does not affect Windows systems" to "Windows binaries have the required library built-in, thus that variable is ignored there", or something similar ("may have" instead of "have", etc.?) ? --The Gig 09:18, February 12, 2012 (UTC) :::::: Given that you actually had a copy of libcurl in your OA Windows installation, it might be plain wrong to say that the library is built-in (meaning in all OA Windows versions and variants). I don't know when and why the official Windows binaries have libcurl built-in, so I'd just stay with "maybe" or "it depends" (since that's all we can say for sure :) ). :::::: // r9k 18:34, February 13, 2012 (UTC) :::::::I don't have the time to do it right now, but that shouldn't be a problem... I'll do it within this week (I hope). See you later! :-) --The Gig 00:21, February 15, 2012 (UTC) ::::::::What about "... distribution to another; some versions of binaries may have the required library built-in in themselves, and may consequently ignore the value contained in the variable; this is more probable with Windows executables" ? --The Gig 22:54, February 16, 2012 (UTC)